Talk:Base Defence

Earliest Assault?

Just had my base attacked after six weeks. Fifteen Sectoids and two Cyberdiscs against fourteen un-armoured soldiers with laser rifles and pistols. Naturally, I was slaughtered - a Sectoid with a Blaster Launcher took out two of my last three men as the final insult.

Same here. Was doing really good, had a UFO land early on and scooped it up, got UFO Navigation, Power Source, Elerium-115, Mind Probe, etc. Well, had a base defense pop up, after numerous reloads and restarting the whole thing over, I had a pretty good kill line set up near the hangers. Until some alien slaughters me with a Blaster Launcher after about 10 or so turns... Xylert 22:36, 9 August 2010 (EDT)

Has anyone been attacked at an earlier point? --Majick 05:20, 3 December 2006 (PST)

Attacks on the 3rd or even 2nd week aren't that uncommon on Superhuman level. If the first alien mission is Alien Retaliation and your radar doesn't detect the scout...

Hobbes 10:26, 3 December 2006 (PST)

I have yet to see an initial mission of Retaliation scheduled at game start (before 12:30 Jan. 1 1999) in the save files. However, I don't know whether UFOs other than Retaliation scouts can nominate your base for Retaliation -- and your region always gets a UFO immediately.

Zaimoni 17:07, 3 December 2006 (CST)

Also: if you shoot down the first UFO in your region, and that starts a series of Retaliation missions, not taking out any of the prior ones puts the first Battleship at about 2 weeks out.

Zaimoni 19:39, 3 December 2006 (CST)

In a brand new superhuman campaign where I was running some tests on the hyperwave decoder, occasionally I would pick up UFO-1 as a retaliation scout.

Also, I have had my base get attacked immediately after the first or second missions in both X-Com UFO and TFTD on superhuman difficulty. It wasn't nice, to say the least.

But that's just what I've experienced.

- NKF

Now, that would be interesting if a Hyperwave Decoder at a base automatically scheduled Retaliation missions....

Zaimoni 9:05, 5 December 2006 (CST)

DAMNIT. I just got hit by Sectoids on January 23rd. My chaps are armed with Laser Pistols and Rocket Launchers for crying out loud, how are they supposed to handle these Cyberdisks??? ... Good luck to me, I guess. Jasonred 06:46, 8 March 2009 (CDT)

You just answered yourself. Laser Pistols and rocket launchers. They'll bust through cyberdisc armour no problem. Compared to doing it with just standard rifles, you've got a fighting chance. -NKF 12:45, 8 March 2009 (CDT)

Agreed, you'll be fine with that weapon mix. Conserve your rocket ammo, use it wisely. Even better if you have some Stun Rods. The worst risk is when Cyberdisks explode near your troops when you kill them. But if you finish them off with Stun Rods they don't explode. Good luck! (And to the topic: don't think I've had earlier than about the 2nd week, and usually just at the end of Jan.) Spike 13:38, 8 March 2009 (CDT)

About two games back I got a Base Defense on Jan 3rd. That was a very brief restart. Venganza 00:55, 4 August 2009 (EDT)

No way! You should've gone for it, that would really be fun. 8 guys, a rocket launcher, HC-HE, some grenades - go on, you can take 'em!!! Or send me the savefile, I'd love to try that one. Spike 04:58, 4 August 2009 (EDT)

Beginner level, had only shot down a small, one-alien scout, then got a base defense. I don't even think it was past the 2 week mark, as my living quarters and the like that I bought on Jan 1st hadn't finished building. Android 12:27, 31 January 2010 (EST)

And how did the fight go? What kind of aliens? Sectoids and Cyberdiscs, hopefully. Spike 18:17, 5 February 2010 (EST)

Psi and visual contact

I was just checking the new changes and noted the affect paragraph refer to keeping soldiers out of sight during the alien turn to keep them from being attacked with psi.

The alien's don't need visual contact at any time. They already know where you are and will start attacking even if you are successful in keeping out of sight (try rooting the aliens to the spot by setting their energy and energy recharge to 0).

Although there appears to be short period from the time you start the battle before they start using their psi attacks. This appears to vary depending on difficulty level and the psi strength level of your troops.

- NKF 18:41, 17 May 2008 (PDT)

Probably not the best place to put the info, but here it is: there are two conditions that cause the aliens to know the position of all your troops: after 20 turns have elapsed (you can change the value in the executable at offset 0x10F4), or if only 2 (offset 0x10EF in the executable) or less aliens remains alive (this explains why a single commander can psi attack from the beginning if he is the only survivor). Seb76 15:23, 18 May 2008 (PDT)

Ah, I knew there was some sort of grace period. So 20 turns eh? Good to know. Really good to know (although very bad for my play style, since I take it slow). Does it get adjusted by difficulty or the presence of psi-weakling (of a single digit nature) in any way? -NKF 22:39, 18 May 2008 (PDT)

Yeah, this explains the sudden rush of aliens out of their UFO at around turn 20 I guess. I found nothing related to psi-weaklings. As for target selection, everything that is conscious, xcom, small unit, not already under mind control and whose unitpos[8] is less than the attacker's intelligence is susceptible to being attacked. There is then some computing involving distance from target, target psi-strength and psi-skill, attacker psi-attack strength, and a random number between 0 and 50 (the formula is too complex to my liking). The potential target which fits best may be attacked (based on some other unclarified randomness). If someone wants to perform more analysis, the subroutine starts at virtual offset 0x404650. Actually, patching the 0x83 at that address with a 0xC3 should completely disable psi-attacks from aliens (may be useful for testing) Seb76 12:29, 19 May 2008 (PDT)

There's also the break that comes after a turn where you manage to kill a fair number of aliens. Even if you don't cause them to panic, they often stop Psi Attacks after you force a successful round. From a storyline perspective, the officers are probably busy rallying the troops and so they can't use Psi on you. Of course, the best way to stop Psionic attacks is to kill or otherwise incapacitate the psions. Arrow Quivershaft 21:08, 17 May 2008 (PDT)

Does damage make a difference?

If a base defence managed to damage (but not kill) the UFO before it landed, would it mean that less aliens will spawn? Cesium 04:41, 25 November 2009 (EST)

No, you either destroy the craft, or you face the full crew. - Bomb Bloke 04:51, 25 November 2009 (EST)

So then if damaging an incoming Battleship/dreadnaught doesn't kill any of the crew/reduce the size of the assault, it would seem that Missile/Torpedo, Laser/Gauss, and any defenses without a Grav/Bombardment shield, are completely useless.

There would be Zero effect if you put up two missile defenses at your new base? Just as there would be zero effect if you put up 4 Plasma defenses but didn't have a grav shield? (even with a grav shield, it probably wont matter either)

Would it even be possible to fit enough missile defenses into a base (without using a grav shield), to stop an attack?

This seems poorly implemented, as if missile/laser defenses are useless, and any defense without a grav shield is useless (or will take up so much space, the base itself is useless). I would recommend an "un-official patch" ie (community accepted mod) that either reduces the number of enemies in an attack in proportion to damage - or allows smaller ships to perform the assault sooner, if the base is undefended. Ie a Large Scout/Cruiser - if it locates your base, will immediately go for your base (or maybe only if the defense strength is below a threshold), followed by a battleship/Dreadnaught if it fails (or if its smaller crew fails? or maybe you can say these retaliation ships are packed with much larger crews than normal, and give them the same assault crew size). Thus having some base defenses would buy you some time until the "big boys" show up, and the attacks by smaller ships would give you more advance notice that you will have a battleship/dreadnaught heading your way in the not-too-distant-future. - X-COMmunit

Hiya X-COMmunit. Just a note, you can sign your posts by adding four tildes (~~~~) to the end of them. Makes it easier to keep track of who said what, and when.

According to Base Defense Measures, Missiles/Torpedos deal 500 damage each, while Battleships have a damage capacity of 3,200 and Dreadnoughts are at 3,400. Therefore seven such modules would be required, as a minimum, to prevent an attack - and given their accuracy rating of 50%, you'd have less then a one-in-a-hundred chance of pulling it off without installing a Grav Shield or additional modules.

However, if you pack enough Missiles in, you'll get acceptable defense for way less cash then the more advanced modules provide. They'll just take up much of your building space. Acceptable for radar outposts, but then, I don't build those (or defenses, for that matter! Bring 'em on!) - my point is that they aren't technically "useless". Just way less useful then the new player would expect.

Anyway, you'd probably be best off posting your thoughts to the Wish List. Note that they all require EXE hacks. - Bomb Bloke 18:10, 5 January 2010 (EST)