User:EsTeR

TROLLS

This is just too good. Enjoy the laugh!

==Taking stock==
EsTeR says he's gone away. I want to do some reversion/rewrites here (I didn't particularly want to wage full-on edit war, but if he's left then there's no reason to leave UFOpaedia Apoc in this state), but I wasn't around for much of this so I don't have a good idea of which pages he did and didn't affect and ''in particular'' which pieces of information he actually full-on moved from one article to another vs. newly added vs. duplicated (in the case of stuff he moved, there's the question of which page it belongs on and we need to make sure we don't lose it, but in the case of duplications we generally want to remove one of the mentions to help undo the bloat).

Do you have some idea of the shape of things? <s>User: 1 CENSORED</s>

Sorry for replying so late, I wasn't active here for a while. Frankly, he changed most of the pages. Among other things:
a) redoing the main page at https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php/Apocalypse. I haven't compared it to the older version, so I guess this is where any major work on the Wiki should start.
b) pretty much all the pages under "Battlefield Tactics & Gameplay" have been extensively changed and information shuffled around. I've lost track of what happened. It will take a *lot* of work to rewrite this.
c) the pages on Damage Modifiers, Vehicles (the general pages, not the ones about specific vehicles), and Buildings have been significantly altered.
d) at least the 4 pages on unused features have been consolidated into one. I don't think the old ones have been deleted though, but at least they aren't on the main page anymore.

Other than that, I see several issues with the Apocalypse part of the Wiki, of which I would highlight:
1) his writing style was very different from the one used on most of the pages, far more suited to a fanmade guide than a wiki - though, admittedly, some of the old pages also had a very "pub talk" style with lots of "you should do XY" which isn't really suited to a wiki, either. Some pages got "trimmed" yet had IMO superfluous info added (e.g. do we really need to describe what explosive damage is?). Spelling/writing standardization would also be nice - e.g. is it X-COM or X-Com? It would also be good to refer to things consistently - e.g. not talking about Security Guards in one article, Building Security in another, and just Guards in a third. Flying vehicles or airborne vehicles? And so on.
2) there is still quite a bit of information that hasn't been verified. This is made worse by the fact that even the OpenApoc team seem to disagree on some things. For example, a lot of info on Organizations can be found floating around their Discord, but after consulting Skin36 and doing extensive in-game testing, I have found some of this info is just outright false - most glaringly, despite what some of the team claim, the Tips Book is outright wrong on the effects of allying with certain Organizations. Skin did mention he found there are quite a few places in the code that the "allied" flags are checked - but it's not obvious what they do.
3) images are often not being displayed correctly. This appears to affect the entire wiki, but is especially visible in the Apocalypse part because so many new ones were added. <s>User: 2 CENSORED</s>

'''Hello, I'm still around.'''<br>
First off, read -every single page- through the whole Apocalypse section. You will have a better understanding of what was done. <br>
1. Most pages were not uniform with many missing pics. The alien buldings pages in particular were needing extensive work and uniformness. I think 99% of the alien dimension anything is complete beside spelling mistakes and minor formatting.<br>
2. A wiki will become shallow and basically useless if you want to make the apoc section like wikipedia's "what not how" format and since there already is such a page, copy and pasting it here is redundant ...but is that what you both want? The whole point of these pages is concrete information which I have added to in a massive way. I have added many 'tactics and gameplay' to pages where it is useful. Expanding those sections would be the way to go and not sterilizing the page to make it like other pages (to other games) found on the internet.<br>
3. Orgs with false information from the hint book has been mentioned in the relevant page.<br>
4. The only pictures which do not display correctly are the title pages within the cut section and one in the citywall section. Every single page has the pictures displaying correctly.<br>
5. Moving pages within the Apocalypse title page was done to organise topics to be together as subtitles. I think I've done a good job but the "Combat Format" should be more integrated into the "Battlescape Tactics And Gameplay" section. I haven't re-written those pages but have dumped information into them to consolidate into one section only... and not like three sub-standard pages dealing with Cut Content as was before. I didn't look good. Old pages are still around - I have not deleted moved content but chose one of the three cut content pages to become the only one.<br>
<br>
<br>
Finally, consider this thought... if the apocalypse section has been added to heavily and cleaned up massively by me, then why are you both complaining that the work which needed to be done, has been done? If you cared about this as much as your demeanor implies then you would have made an effort to fix this section 'years' ago. [[User:EsTeR|EsTeR]]

:We did make an effort to fix it, ''CENSORED'' especially so. Check the edit histories of the Apoc pages and you'll find one or both of us on most of them. Much of the stuff you did is not "work which needed to be done"; it's actual disagreements between us and you. The only thing I recall as truly ''needing'' cleanup prior to your bull-in-a-china-shop act is ''CENSORED'' pseudo-blogging, which admittedly I did let slide mostly because it was confined to a few pages that weren't otherwise in use.
''DELETED'' ....and undoing your damage is a much bigger project than telling you to stop since you've made literally thousands of edits and ''some'' of them are actually okay so simply writing a script to globally rollback everything you've ever done on UFOpaedia would not be the best idea.
:I did actually try to get an admin to intervene last year (I wasn't really looking for you to be banned, just warned with teeth to stop doing the objectionable stuff), but he's mostly absentee as well and I didn't chase it up because I thought you'd left and admin rights are only useful for stopping you rather than for reverting you.  <s>User: 2 CENSORED</s>

:: ''DELETED'' but some choice of words you choose go too far. Damage? If you think what i have done is damage then you go away from here. [[User:EsTeR|EsTeR]]

::: EsTeR, what you did here isn't doing "what needed to be done", it's basically hijacking the whole Apocalypse section of the wiki and turning it into your personal FAQ, which it is not - there are sites like GameFAQs for what you're trying to write. I have little free time and no wish to spend it on edit wars, especially since the admins - and the site in general - seem to be pretty much inactive, but you on the other hand seem to have hours and hours to spend here, and have no problem using them to remove anything done by me or ''CENSORED''. That is why I stopped trying to fix things long ago, as I know you'll just change them the moment I turn my back. But I am hurt to see the pages I worked on so long butchered by you, and I have no wish to communicate with you further. <s>User: 2 CENSORED</s>

::::'''If you do not want your writing to be edited mercilessly, then do not submit it here.''' [[User:EsTeR|EsTeR]]

==Examples==
...of what needed to be done (links below):<br>

Old: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=Dimension_Gate_Generator&oldid=42597
New: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php/Dimension_Gate_Generator

Old: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=Engineering_(Apocalypse)&oldid=99774
New: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php/Engineering_(Apocalypse)

Old: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=Agents_Medals_(Apocalypse)&oldid=24681
New: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php/Agents_Medals_(Apocalypse)

Old: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=Corporate_HQ_(Apocalypse)&oldid=26679
New: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php/Corporate_HQ_(Apocalypse)

Old: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=Difficulty_Levels_(Apocalypse)&oldid=107281
New: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php/Difficulty_Levels_(Apocalypse)

Old: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=Psionics_(Apocalypse)&oldid=92307
New: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php/Psionics_(Apocalypse)

Old: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=Quantum_Physics_Lab_(Apocalypse)&oldid=59664
New: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php/Quantum_Physics_Lab_(Apocalypse)

Old: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=Advanced_Workshop_(Apocalypse)&oldid=59677
New: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php/Advanced_Workshop_(Apocalypse)

Old: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=Mind_Bender&oldid=99136
New: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php/Mind_Bender

Old: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=Biological_Warfare_(Apocalypse)&oldid=42544
New: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php/Biological_Warfare_(Apocalypse)

Old: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php/Metro_Roadgrav_(Apocalypse)
New: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=Metro_Roadgrav_(Apocalypse)&oldid=91004

Old: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=Personal_Disruptor_Shield&oldid=107483
New: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php/Personal_Disruptor_Shield

Old: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=Motion_Scanner_(Apocalypse)&oldid=28291
New: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php/Motion_Scanner_(Apocalypse)

continued...<br>
Honestly, If you think what I have done is damage to few example given above, then you are a troll and should just go join your friend.<br>
aka: '''you go away from here'''.<br>
[[User:EsTeR|EsTeR]]

I love it!!

Its a case of arrogance with a heavy dose of spitting-the-dummy.

I'm User:EsTeR trying to make this the be-all-and-end-all of X-Com Apocalypse knowledge on the internet, yet I've got sour-puss detractors who think they know all, of how it should look. Before I started editing proper (~Mar,2022), this mish-mash of pages with bad writing style on the Apocalypse section, minimal stick-to-the-topic conversational type wording, repetative information on multiple half-arse pages, bad comprehension, minimal amount of pictures, illogical format and missing data is somehow supposed to be "undamaged".
I cannot fathom it...!
For a 25+ year old game it may seem my motivation may be misplaced. Of well, but at the very least, almost 50% of bugs have been (ongoing) found by me and that I invented Stun Raiding ...so stick that whre the...
EsTeR